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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
 Posted - 11/06/2008 : 09:46:23
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New forum member...
anyone else had experience of being on manual payments long term?
haven't got time to go into full details now, but been on manual payments for past 2 years after a year of arguments, errors, incompetance etc following a return to part time work after long period of illness. Was claiming incap ben but not registered disabled or claiming DLA and advisors didn't read / understand guidelines properly, insisting that I didn't qualify for disability premium. Result : claim stopped , started, stopped, underpaid, not backdated properly, stopped, etc etc etc
As result of all the messing around, and a complaint through my MP and a written complaint 2 years ago, I was put on manual payments because "the computer would not accept my details". I live rurally therefore have 26 mile round trip every 4 wks to pay cash into bank. Unable to access dental treatment, unable to sort out council tax (I think I have overpaid council tax for past 3 years), have to sign back of prescriptions as in receipt of WTC but got no proof, can't get NHS exemption on grounds of low income because payments coming through so therefore technically not on low enough income to qualify (allegedly). Have had to have emergency dental treatment to take out a tooth cos teeth now suffering from no regular checkups, can't claim back the cost of the extraction until I get properly on the system and am given an exemption number.
Am now massively out of pocket in expenses incurred trying to sort this out, and the process has really affected my recovery from illness and delayed my return to full time work and am therefore trapped in this situation due to anxiety and stress. From time to time I get demands for repayment for all WTC paid for any one of the past 3 financial years, on one occasion including a demand for repayment for child tax credit - I got no kids and never claimed child tax credit (perhaps it was for the dogs?!)
Latest situation : after being made redundant in Feb, got back into work 7 weeks later and therefore requalified under 8 wk linking rule. Was told that claim would be automatically reinstated when I informed them of this by phone and apparently my claim had gone for "reassessment". It took several follow up phone calls over next 3 months before an extremely unpleasant rude and unhelpful advisor told me I had to put in a new claim. At the time, I was so ill with anxiety I couldn't speak to the helpline myself and had given written permission for an advocate to deal with them on my behalf. Advisor refused to deal with advocate, threatened to put phone down on me when I got upset and distressed, then accused me of mud slinging when I asked where I could get more info. That was a over a month ago.
New claim submitted 22 May, rang earlier this week to find out what was happening ( am now on highest rate of care DLA so should qualify automatically) - guess what - they can't find my new claim, so they've put a trace on it and if they can't find it, guess what, they will put me on manual and send me out a new claim form.
If no payment received before end of this month, will not be able to continue work as can't afford MOT on car and no bus service where I live. Am now owed WTC from 24 March. got 3 months mortgage arrears now and incurring penalty charges every month and getting unpleasant letters from mortgage company every few days, despite explaining the situation to them and trying to maintain payments so that arrears don't get worse. Am getting close to major relapse due to all the stress again - was nearly hospitalised in March due to all this.
Wrote to Gordon Brown in March asking why I should vote for him and explaining WTC probs - the reply from one of his underlings says that my letter has been passed to HM Treasury who will respond to issues I raised (nothing heard, of course), and no reason given as to why I should vote labour in future. Luckily, I have a tory MP, David Maclean, and have passed all details on to him - he was involved 2 years ago when I submitted my complaint (which has never been even acknowledged)- his response to the copy of the G Brown letter I sent him for info says "their incompetance never ceases to amaze me".
Anyone know whether you can sue the government for personal injury? Also can you sue government on Disability Discrimination grounds.
The tax credits customer charter is not worth the paper its written on - in my case they have broken virtually everyone of their promises.
Sorry, was trying to keep this brief, but its so good to find somewhere to vent 3 years of frustration, anger, disappointment, anxiety and fear to people who you know will understand.
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo)
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Robert
Da Purple one
United Kingdom
827 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2008 : 12:06:58
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Hi whitevanwoman..
You story sounds disgraceful, with the way you have been treated by the HMRC, i am sorry that i can't give you advice on dissability issues, but stay around, we have someone who can..regarding letters to Gordon Brown, the guy is a waste off space,and you will be lucky if the treasury reply within 3 months..
your MP is the best way forward,and some may ask if you would be willing to talk too the press, about your dealings with the HMRC..as your story sounds horrendous..
The truth is out there.. GO get it......Non Illigitamus Carborundum
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Ali M-W
Da Tech(y ones)
3296 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2008 : 21:15:33
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Whitevanwoman, my head reels with all the different combinations of problems HMRC inflict on us, so for case ideas I would recommend Paula and the www.taxCC.org website dispute pack, any members' suggestions you like to follow, and any advice Splashin (where did she go?) and MissFroy can offer - as they do seem to know their stuff.
As for disability issues - we could use some research on these. I know Rowan has an interest, too - and other contributors here. I was always intending to look into that side of things more, but never enough hours in the day. Would welcome any insights you can give.
Campaigning with us is also a good antidote to 'learned helplessness' and depression, as we are actively shaping our fate and not passively accepting or being ground down by it.
Welcome aboard!
Trinity: The answer is out there… and it's looking for you, and it will find you if you want it to.
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2008 : 21:25:50
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>>Campaigning with us is also a good antidote to 'learned helplessness' and depression, as we are actively shaping our fate and not passively accepting or being ground down by it.
Welcome aboard!<<
I agree with this!
I also believe in getting Mp's, the CAB and the media involved too.
As for Splashin, there's no truth in the rumour that I've kidnapped her!!
"Dave Anderson (Labour) MP for Blaydon rocks!!" |
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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
Posted - 16/06/2008 : 19:57:22
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Thanks folks, for your replies.
Have had a small triumph but the battle is far from won...
After my previous post I gave it 2 days and then decided to phone helpline again for any news but claim still not showing on system and no news regarding the trace.
"Hmmmm" I thought, "somewhere I've got the number for the tax credit office in Preston which customers are not supposed to be given...." so I found it and rang it and spoke to a young lady (Becky) who was really really helpful after I explained the situation. In a very cheerful voice she said " but your new claim is here..." !!!!
I didn't know whether to be angry or relieved - anyway she said she couldn't authorise the claim herself but would speak to her supervisor and would ring me back that day between 12 & 4pm. At 12.05 she rang me back to say yes, my claim was ok and they were putting it on the system that day and I should get a payment the following day. In the event that the system payment didn't go through, she would ring me at 9.30 the following morning to let me know and would send out a manual payment. Unfortunately the system wouldn't accept my new claim, but Becky rang as promised at 9.30 on the dot and I got a manual payment through on Saturday. Admittedly it is only an emergency payment for one month and there is a backpayment due from 24 March but she assured me that they are continuing to work towards getting me on the system and that she will calculate the backpayment due and will be in touch this week....
I've said that I'm going to write to her manager to commend her - she was helpful, understanding and most importantly she rang back as promised, sorted problems out as promised and treated me with respect which so many other staff seem unable to do.
So at least I can now afford to keep my car on the road and keep my job - however the manual payments black hole is still threatening to swallow me up again and I still can't claim my refund for emergency dental treatment, or see a dentist, or officially prove that I get tax credits for my free prescription entitlement, or sort out my council tax benefit etc etc etc
But don't worry folks, I'm not giving up - I've got Becky's number now & she's my secret weapon! Plus, I'm damned if I'm going to let them get away with this, even if I have to stand outside the tax credit office in preston and take my t-shirt off!
Have been building up a file of incompetence and errors over the past few years and am quite prepared to use it and go to the press if I have to.
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo) |
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 16/06/2008 : 21:05:37
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>>Have been building up a file of incompetence and errors over the past few years and am quite prepared to use it and go to the press if I have to.<<
This - and getting your MP on your side - is the way to win this.
Good luck, keep hitting them and keep us informed!!
"Dave Anderson (Labour) MP for Blaydon rocks!!" |
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Sarah
Rank; Captain Gordon
247 Posts |
Posted - 16/06/2008 : 23:36:31
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Hi Whitevanwoman,
If you are happy to use your case in the media, please email PJ direct as she is developing a list of members who will speak to the media. Thanks. |
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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
 Posted - 17/06/2008 : 08:57:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Sarah
Hi Whitevanwoman,
If you are happy to use your case in the media, please email PJ direct as she is developing a list of members who will speak to the media. Thanks.
Will do - still haven't fully explored all the site yet - there's too much, but I did see a link to a media list.
Thanks
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo) |
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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
Posted - 17/06/2008 : 10:19:30
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Well - my faith in people has been restored by the wonderful Becky at TCO Preston.
She has just rung me to say that she has now got me on the system, has told me what my annual entitlement is, what my 4 weekly payments will be and that my backpayment will be in my bank account by thursday (this means I can pay off my 3 months mortgage arrears). I should receive a proper award notice in due course. I'm pretty gobsmacked!
She said that the computer error causing all the problems over the past few years was caused by manual error (ie the staff putting in wrong info over and over again) and that all that was needed was to put an "end it" on my claim and start from scratch. Why this wasn't done 2 years ago I don't know. She said it wasn't really her job to do this but she was glad to do - what a star!
I asked her if she knew what was going on with my complaint from 2 years ago and she said that there was a note on my file to say that my MP was involved so it was now at second tier. Her advice was that I do nothing further (in case it confused their tiny minds - my words not hers) and wait until my MP had had a response and then take it to the third tier or the adjudicator if necessary.
So in the meantime I shall go back through the past 2 years paperwork, phone bills, bank & mortgage & credit card statements, mileage records etc and work out just how much its cost me and how much I can claim in reimbursement of expenses. I'm also going to claim as much as possible for distress, delay etc as I've got medical evidence to prove the detrimental effect all this has had on my health. I know it could be weeks yet before I hear from my MP but it'll probably take weeks to work out my expenses incurred.
So for those of you out there - take heart - although alot of the helpline advisors seem like unhelpful gits, there are some really genuinely caring people working for HMRC who do their best to do a good job and go the extra mile.
And the first thing I'm going to do is to write a letter to Becky's manager and copy it to Richard Sommersgill and my MP in praise of her dedication.
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo) |
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 17/06/2008 : 11:28:09
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>>So in the meantime I shall go back through the past 2 years paperwork, phone bills, bank & mortgage & credit card statements, mileage records etc and work out just how much its cost me and how much I can claim in reimbursement of expenses. I'm also going to claim as much as possible for distress, delay etc<<
Quite right too - their own rules state that you're entitled to this.
>>So for those of you out there - take heart - although alot of the helpline advisors seem like unhelpful gits, there are some really genuinely caring people working for HMRC who do their best to do a good job and go the extra mile.<<
I agree with this, and thank you for reminding us.
>>And the first thing I'm going to do is to write a letter to Becky's manager and copy it to Richard Sommersgill and my MP in praise of her dedication.<<
I'm pleased that you're taking this action. I think it's only fair that if you're happy to write letters of COMPLAINT when things go wrong it's only right that you should write letters of COMPLIMENT when they go right! I would urge ALL of our members to do this.
"Dave Anderson (Labour) MP for Blaydon rocks!!" |
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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
Posted - 17/06/2008 : 12:18:45
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MESSAGE FOR WILLOW
Hi, got your message, I'd been wondering about doing that anyway...
Am going to ask advice from PJ, Ali, Sarah etc and will PM or email you back.
Now it looks like my battle may be nearly won, maybe I can help with someone else's. Keep smiling x
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo) |
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Willow
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
56 Posts |
Posted - 18/06/2008 : 10:07:39
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| Many thanks, whitevanwoman - and congratulations on getting so far ahead with your own case. |
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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
Posted - 21/06/2008 : 13:25:05
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quote:
Originally posted by whitevanwoman
... my backpayment will be in my bank account by thursday (this means I can pay off my 3 months mortgage arrears). I should receive a proper award notice in due course...
OK - the latest news...
I got my backpayment paid directly into my bank account which is GREAT and am now up to date with mortgage etc...
however, yesterday I got an award notice which says " we are sorry to tell you that you do not qualify for tax credits for the following reason - DUPLICATE CLAIM ALREADY RECEIVED"
Uh, oh! I haven't submitted 2 claims so I'm guessing that the computer system has rejected my new claim because the lovely Becky had already put it on the system. Either that or they have finally sorted out the original problem which means that my new claim has been rejected because they have sorted out all the probs with my old claim. Who knows?! Not quite sure what they outcome will be but I could be getting another overpayment notice now in due course! And I could end up on manual payments again if they've stopped the claim that Becky has set up. I won't bother ranting about inefficiency, incompetence, poor communication etc as its all been said before.
Been trying to get through to helpline to query but "high call volumes - unable to take your call" - same old rubbish. I wonder how many attempts it will take to get through this time?
Then today a letter from the Customer Support Unit in Preston which says "thank you for letter of 19 April to Rt Hon Gordon Brown (is there anything honourable about G Brown?) about your claim. Your MP has also written to us about your case, so we will send our reply directly to him covering all of the issues you have raised." This is from R Cartledge, Customer Support Manager.
So lets see what happens next!
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo) |
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 21/06/2008 : 21:04:55
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>>Then today a letter from the Customer Support Unit in Preston which says "thank you for letter of 19 April to Rt Hon Gordon Brown (is there anything honourable about G Brown?)<<
Is there anything "Right" about him??
"Dave Anderson (Labour) MP for Blaydon rocks!!" |
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auntieh
Rank; Really should become a politician
United Kingdom
619 Posts |
Posted - 21/06/2008 : 23:05:44
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Yes he's a right idiot!
"You can dress a pig in a suit but you can't stop it grunting" |
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 22/06/2008 : 13:31:44
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quote:
Originally posted by auntieh
Yes he's a right idiot!
"You can dress a pig in a suit but you can't stop it grunting"
Aye, that's about "right"!! 
"Dave Anderson (Labour) MP for Blaydon rocks!!" |
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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
 Posted - 24/06/2008 : 13:11:09
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Ok guys - latest news ... AN APOLOGY!!!!!
I've just got a letter from my MP (David Maclean Cons - I love him!) with an attached letter from HMRC - MP has asked me to keep him up to date with developments and he will continue to chase it up if nothing resolved in next couple of weeks.
Letter from Barry Malone, Customer Support Manager TCO Preston (I note that they have stopped now giving out their direct dial number on correspondence and are simply giving helpline number).
Letter says :
Thank you for your letter.... I have been asked to reply on behalf of Richard Summersgill... sorry for delay in replying.
I am sorry that a technical difficulty prevented previous payments being issued directly to "whitevanwoman"s bank account. We send payments by cash-cheque to ensure that the tax credits were being paid and received regularly. I am sorry that this method of payment has caused "whitevanwoman" some problems and inconvenience.
My apologies also that attempts to correct "WVW"s previous award is taking longer than expected. We are urgently looking into the technical issues preventing reinstatement of "WVW"s 2005-2006 award and hope to have the problem resolved as quickly as poss. We are treating this case as a priority. I can confirm that recovery action of any previous overpayments has been suspended until problems affecting the award have been resolved.
So that we can closely monitor "WVW"s award, we are assigning a new caseworker who will be sending "WVW" a separate letter shortly giving their name and contact number.
So as I see it:
1. they have admitted technical issues with my original claim - therefore their fault (I have been told on one occasion it was a staff training issue as staff did not know the guidelines properly and therefore claim was initially set up incorrectly, on another occasion I was told that the technical issue was caused by too many people changing details on the claim causing the computer system to eventually reject my claim completely)
2. concern about the phrase "recovery action of any previous overpayments has been suspended until the problems affecting the award have been resolved"- I don't think I have been overpaid, I was simply receiving overpayment notices because the computer system wouldn't accept me and because of their "technical issue" but what this is saying is that if there is an overpayment, they will not write it off, I will still have to go through dispute and appeal process presumably
3. Absolutely still no reference to my complaint submitted July 06 regarding the problems with the 2005-06 claim, nor any reference to any compensatory & reimbursement payments so presumably I will have to continue to fight on to get these which I will not be able to do until these "technical issues" have been resolved.
I will write back to "my mate dave MP" and express these concerns to him (enclosing of course some taxcc posters etc). Does anyone have any other suggestions / comments?
It is such a relief to get this letter - I feel the migraine that has been plaguing me for 4 days receding already - I really did expect a much more negative reply from HMRC but I suspect that sending a letter of concern about my health and the effects all this was having on my health from my Community Psychiatric Nurse with my letter to my MP may well have made a big difference, so I would urge you all that if you feel your tax credit probs are having an effect on your health, get it recorded on your medical records and ask for a letter of confirmation from your GP, even if you have to pay for it (and if you do, consider changing GP) as you can add that cost back to your list of reimbursement of expenses.
Willow, so sorry not to have emailed you yet - really not been so good over w'end but am just about to do so now...
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo) |
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 24/06/2008 : 13:26:22
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>>I suspect that sending a letter of concern about my health and the effects all this was having on my health from my Community Psychiatric Nurse with my letter to my MP may well have made a big difference, so I would urge you all that if you feel your tax credit probs are having an effect on your health, get it recorded on your medical records and ask for a letter of confirmation from your GP, even if you have to pay for it (and if you do, consider changing GP) as you can add that cost back to your list of reimbursement of expenses.<<
I agree WVW. I think you have got this spot-on.
I'm pleased that you've got your MP's support - and have been kind enough to let him know about our happy little band here at TCC. Thank you for that.
I'm sorry to hear about your health issues & hope that you'll be feeling better soon.
"Dave Anderson (Labour) MP for Blaydon rocks!!" |
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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
Posted - 24/06/2008 : 13:34:05
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Cheers Alan - am doing ok, its just the waiting,,, and the waiting,,, and the waiting,,, sometimes it just gets to you, and knocks you off balance a bit just as you've found a nice safe equilibrium.
BTW, my mam's from tyneside - way aye man :-)
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo) |
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 24/06/2008 : 13:53:24
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>>Cheers Alan - am doing ok, its just the waiting,,, and the waiting,,, and the waiting,,, sometimes it just gets to you, and knocks you off balance a bit just as you've found a nice safe equilibrium.<<
Yes, I know Bonny Lass. I've been there & done all that myself & don't want to go through it again!!
Nice to hear that your mam's a Geordie. It's probably where you got your Sensible Head from!
"Dave Anderson (Labour) MP for Blaydon rocks!!" |
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whitevanwoman
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
United Kingdom
65 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2008 : 11:43:14
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Latest update - I don't know where the time has gone... it was summer (allegedly) when I last posted about my case and now we're battening down the hatches for the winter.
I did send a letter commending Becky to her manager but received no acknowledgement. I also sent a copy of my letter to Becky so that even if her manager didn't pass it on to her, she would know. I wonder if I will ever see my letter quoted by HMRC in an attempt to prove how good they are - if they do, and I see it, don't worry, I will respond and make it clear that I was commending an individual NOT the institution nor their normal practices!
I haven't yet sent in my invoice for reimbursement of my costs, haven't finished going through all the paperwork - to be honest, haven't done anything on my own case for weeks, been busy with other stuff, work and staying well but am intending to pick it up soon and submit it and will let you know what the response is.
My present claim is still in normal payment and nothing has been heard with regard to the alleged overpayment from 2005 which has been suspended whilst they are "working hard to resolve the technical issues" affecting that claim. Again I will keep you all posted if there is any further news.
At the end of this month, my working hours will be reducing (I work in the tourism industry so over the winter season my hours drop) to under the limit for tax credits for disabled people (ie 16 hrs per week). I intend to start up my own business and will be registering as self-employed at the time that my hours reduce (27 Oct) so I will be working 6 hrs / week for my present employer and probably about 12 - 15 hrs / week self-employed. I do not anticipate making any profit (and probably very little turnover) for at least 3- 6 months, whilst the business gets going. In the first few months, I will be working on my business plan, building stock and doing marketing/networking. I hope to be starting to generate income round about next Easter.
Am I right in thinking that I should still qualify for the disability premium of WTC if the total of my employed hours and self-employed hours are between 16 and 30, even if I generate no income? I am still receiving the highest care level of DLA. Perhaps Splashin or MissFroy2 could advise. I have an appointment with the Disability Employment Advisor at the JobCentre in a couple of weeks who hopefully will be able to advise but any info before then would be really helpful.
If Willow is reading this, I hope that all went well with the delivery of your latest little bundle of joy, and that it was a girl, thus removing any debate about the naming of it with your daughter! Do keep in touch - we joined about the same time so I feel a kind of link with you. You can PM or email me if you don't want to post. xxx
Instructions for life:
1.breathe in
2.breathe out
3.repeat ad infinitum
"Realise that if you have time to whine and complain about something then you have the time to do something about it" (Anthony d'Angelo) |
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the manual payments black hole syndrome
