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splashin
Rank; Undercover HMRC Spy
Belize
446 Posts |
 Posted - 01/11/2007 : 11:35:23
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Dune
Don't leave without closing this down first. Don't let them win !!!!!!!!
 
Splashin |
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dune
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
15 Posts |
Posted - 21/12/2007 : 15:50:01
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A little update:
I worte to my MP and fair enough he contacted the TC folk. I wass promised that the 2nd teir investigation would be completed by Dec 07. Still nothing until I received a further letter from my MP.
Enclosed was a letter to the MP from the TC office:
It appologises for the delay in sorting out my claim but goes on to say... That they have identified some changes in procedures that they need to follow before they can make changes to older tax credit awards and therefore have suspended work on my complaint. They will inform the MP when the TC will be able to reply to the complaint. Also the MP can contact them anytime via the MP hotline to the office! Must have agreat deal of pressure from MPs at the moment.
Am I being stupid here? Are they changing the prcedures to screw me and everyone else? I know there are some people on here that work for the TC office, do you know anything about these procedural changes?
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Ali M-W
Da Tech(y ones)
3296 Posts |
Posted - 21/12/2007 : 17:02:16
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quote:
Originally posted by dune
A little update:
I worte to my MP and fair enough he contacted the TC folk. I wass promised that the 2nd teir investigation would be completed by Dec 07. Still nothing until I received a further letter from my MP.
Enclosed was a letter to the MP from the TC office:
It appologises for the delay in sorting out my claim but goes on to say... That they have identified some changes in procedures that they need to follow before they can make changes to older tax credit awards and therefore have suspended work on my complaint. They will inform the MP when the TC will be able to reply to the complaint. Also the MP can contact them anytime via the MP hotline to the office! Must have agreat deal of pressure from MPs at the moment.
Am I being stupid here? Are they changing the prcedures to screw me and everyone else? I know there are some people on here that work for the TC office, do you know anything about these procedural changes?
  I think you are right to be suspicious - there is certainly a lot of moving of goalposts to secure them a constant advantage over us. Hopefully someone will soon offer some insights into what might be going on... not that it is ever very clear, it seems, even to those directly involved in this work. 
Machine god: WHAT IF YOU FAIL?
Neo: I won't
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 21/12/2007 : 18:35:37
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Maybe they're just moving the deck chairs around - like on the Titanic?
Geordie: "Yon lass's gorra fyece lyke a bagga spanners!"
English: "That lady's face is rather unnatractive" |
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dune
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
15 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2008 : 19:37:52
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| As you know I am waiting for a decision from the second tier complaints and my MP has written to them. blah blah... Right next thing I know is I get a letter from the ordinary TCO saying that I owe money for 2005 - 2006... in the region of £3500... I only received £40 per month FFS. And that was taken off me to repay the supposed over payment... I am loosing my rag with these idoits. I am just about to start writing to my MP again and I will be including the PM and the leader of the opposition to see if I can stir the ****e between the parties! |
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splashin
Rank; Undercover HMRC Spy
Belize
446 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2008 : 19:51:56
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Dune
Oh my!.. 3.5k
Well that defo says to me you have got system errors in the history of your claim. Do you have SAR documents? 
Splashin |
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Rowan
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
36 Posts |
Posted - 14/01/2008 : 11:40:52
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Hello,
My husband receives DLA which entitles him to extra Tax Credits. He does not receive the higher rate of DLA and this means he receives the LOWER disabled component of Tax Credits. There are at least two components but this is not made clear. In 03/04 it appeared on his award that he was in receipt of the higher component - he didn't know there was one! Still, he was punished for 'claiming' it when actually it appeared unannounced and unexplained. It was also undetected for at least a year because award forms only say "is disabled" or more recently "a disabled component" which is correct whichever component one receives! 
Also, my husband is particularly affronted by the logo on their letters which says "Positive About Disabled People" - what does that mean? It implies they take disability into account when dealing with people! That shouldn't be allowed because they clearly do not!  |
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 14/01/2008 : 12:48:13
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>>>Also, my husband is particularly affronted by the logo on their letters which says "Positive About Disabled People" - what does that mean? It implies they take disability into account when dealing with people! That shouldn't be allowed because they clearly do not! >>>
I think this warrants a complaint to the Advertising Standards Authority Rowan.
You can make a complaint online and you may be surprised to find the link to their site right here; http://www.asa.org.uk/asa/
Get stuck into them Bonny Lass.
If we hoy enough excrement at them some of it just might stick!!
(hoy = throw)
Geordie: "Yon lass's gorra fyece lyke a bagga spanners!"
English: "That lady's face is rather unnatractive" |
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dune
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
15 Posts |
Posted - 15/01/2008 : 19:05:49
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| Rowan, I am in exactley the oposite situation. I receive the higher award plus a care component. This has been proved to the idiots and still say that I am not entilted to the TCs that I received. I have even had an adviros say that I was eligible but would have to complain to get anything refunded/sorted! They realy dont know what they are doing... |
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dune
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
15 Posts |
Posted - 15/01/2008 : 20:29:09
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Sorry what are SAR documents?
I thought I would post this letter. Its being sent out to my MP the PM and Opposition once Ive proof read it properly...
Dear Sir,
I wrote and asked for your help during 2007, when the Second Tier Complaints section of the Tax Credit Office refused to answer my letters. Thanks to your intervention the Tax Credit Office (TCO) have replied although only in a pseudo form. The reply was a reduced version of the letter I assume they sent you, stating that my file was on hold until specific elements of regulations had been clarified. I am still awaiting the outcome.
As you will be aware from my previous commiunications I am a disabled, I received the higher rate of mobility allowance and also a lower rate of care allowance. The problems have occurred due to the TCO not following the procedures outlined by the guidance document supplied with the application forms. The guidelines state that I must;
• work more than 16 hours per week,
• have a disability that puts me in a disadvantage in getting a job,
• satisfy the qualifying benefit test,
To satisfy the qualifying benefit test I must receive either DLA or Attendance Allowance,
I receive both there is no statement of which level you must receive anywhere on the document. I have several copies of the official document if you wish to examine.
I have spoken to various advisors at the TCO who have said that I am eligible for the payments, but to have the decision reversed I would need to complain to the TCO formally. It would seem that the advisors are not a variety of formal communication, or they don’t want to be involved with a simple task. Maybe they are there just for lip service.
I now find myself in position that is wholly untenable forced upon me by the untrained and ill-educated staff at the Preston TCO. Only this week I received a further letter dated 20th December 2007,claiming that I had informed the TCO of changes to my circumstances and that I was no longer eligible to receive tax credits and that for the year 2005 to 2006 I was required to pay back the sum of £3253.64. I did not receive any monies for that period.
First, I would assume that the TCO have illegally sourced data from elsewhere as I have had no communication with them since June of 2007, including application forms. I would therefore conclude that a breach of Data Protection has been perpetrated. If so legal action should be progressed under the Data Protection Act 1998, I will be contacting the Information Commissioners Office in due course.
Second I am currently receiving a sum of circa £40 each month whilst the Second Tier investigation is underway. The TCOs guidelines state that whilst a complaint is under investigation all other matters are put on hold. Unfortunately it would appear as usual that the TCO do not follow their own published guidelines.
I have received claims for back payments from between £2000 and £8000. The TCO cannot even decide how much I owe them, never mind come to a conclusion on their own legislation. I am a highly educated Chartered Structural Engineer and if I practiced my profession in this manner would be struck off. It would seem that employees of the TCO are allowed to conduct themselves in such a way and still keep their job that it beggars belief.
I am forwarding this letter to both the Prime Minister and the Leader of the Opposition to see if any of this country’s elected politicians will take my plight seriously.
I hope that my plea for help has not fallen on deaf ears and rather than just receiving a post card from the House of Commons I will receive a comprehensive reply stating what will be accomplished and within what time scale. This matter had now been outstanding for nigh on 3 years and has affected my health to a significant degree. I am now in such I quandary over this matter I am considering leaving this country to ply my profession in a more proficient and caring society.
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auntieh
Rank; Really should become a politician
United Kingdom
619 Posts |
Posted - 15/01/2008 : 22:24:16
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Well said Dune! The incompetence of HMRC goes from strength to strength. I hope you receive a reply soon but don't hold your breath!
Auntie
"You can dress a pig in a suit but you can't stop it grunting" |
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dune
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
15 Posts |
Posted - 28/01/2008 : 18:53:57
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Yet another update. Not had anything back from the MPs or PM. Had a lovely letter from the TCO demanding the payment. I rang up the help line and after 45 mins of waiting, I advised the teleoperator that I was recording the conversation as I had had too many people lie to me. He refused to talk to me and put the phone down. Its a wonder that the TCO record all calls but they dont like you doing so.
I rang back and spoke to a higher up! He was very helpfull and took my complaint and agreed with the premise of my problem. He seemed to be one of the few that actually knew what he was talking about! I was astonished!!! He told me that he could not talk directly to TCO and all communication between him, his staff and the TCO was one way email. What a great system, I wonder who thought of that.
He passed my complaint on to an even higher up who could talk directly to the TCO. I am now awaiting a return phone call. May be and its a small maybe, I might actually get some things sorted, may be not all but some. Thinking again proberbly none but youve got to hope ... lol |
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Alan the Geordie
Da Purple one
2787 Posts |
Posted - 28/01/2008 : 21:29:00
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Hi Dune
If you haven't heard anything from your MP COMPLAIN about him/her.
These b uggers/b uggeresses work for US - WE pay their salaries so we are entitled to be calling the shots!!
I'm very happy to say that my MP (Dave Anderson) is working very well for me, but if he wasn't I'd soon be letting him know!
Geordie: "Yon lass's gorra fyece lyke a bagga spanners!"
English: "That lady's face is rather unnatractive" |
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familytaxcredit
Forum Admin
371 Posts |
Posted - 29/01/2008 : 00:54:10
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>>Maybe they're just moving the deck chairs around - like on the Titanic?>>> oh my, you crack me up sometimes Al, lol
But at least the band kept playing their tune, not sure whom the band would be on whose side, its a bloody phonomena..I bags the double base, I may keep afloat a little longer -;)
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splashin
Rank; Undercover HMRC Spy
Belize
446 Posts |
Posted - 29/01/2008 : 01:36:54
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quote:
Originally posted by dune
Sorry what are SAR documents?
Dune
Go back to the home page and read about how to dispute overpayment.
Here you should find it no problem.
A SARN REQUEST
THIS WOULD BE ALL DATA HELD ABOUT YOU BY A COMPANY, DOESN'T HAVE TO BE HMRC. YOU CAN REQUEST ALL DOCUMENTS, RECORDINGS ETC THEY HOLD ON YOU. IT TAKES (OR SHOULD) TAKE NO MORE THAN 40 DAYS (BUT IT DOES). THE THINGS WHICH SHOW HERE COULD NEVER BE SEEN ON ANY AWARD NOTICE.
SEND FOR IT ASAP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
Splashin |
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familytaxcredit
Forum Admin
371 Posts |
Posted - 29/01/2008 : 01:42:27
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And I have had no response (the obudsman told me to get stuffed() well not really it never got went to the obudsman, only the ombudsman office, her serfs chose not to investigate. They only acted on what I complained about to hmrc/mp etc, except they chose only to act on hmrc evidence, they never contacted me for contradictory evidence, of course they didn't want to know, just like the kangaroo court hearing I had, even the judge said he didn't want to know, but he did state his sorrow, it did not matter.
A week or so went by, then hmrc send me (were going to get you letter) aka pay up or else, I told them I did not have the means to pay, (without admission of guilt).. no reply, although their letter said they will cease goods etc etc if not paid.
Even today my house is locked full time, they will litterally have to batter my house doors down to get in...and so be it
This goes back to 2003, the court 'hearing' was 12-months ago
must edit 'hearings' not one but two. Hmrc can adjourn a hearing when timing does not suit them. I had to go through two hearings, because hmrc adjourned the first because they did not have facts together...they took me to court 'without facts' after 4 years? A good and fair minded judge would throw it out, unfortunately the judge's hands are tied
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Ali M-W
Da Tech(y ones)
3296 Posts |
Posted - 14/02/2008 : 08:29:23
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Dune - just wondering how things were going and if you had any news for us?
Morpheus: The Matrix is everywhere. It is…the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you from the truth.
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dune
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
15 Posts |
Posted - 21/02/2008 : 19:40:14
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I just logged on to post the latest update to the ongoing saga that is the TCO..Thanks for asking Ali!
My letter to the PM got a reply, not much of one but a reply. The leader of the opposition (Good Conservative minister) cant be bothered to reply I think because I am in a labour ward, thanks if your reading this (I doubt it but worth a try!). My MP didnt reply but contacted the TCO again. I received a comprehesive reply from the TCO acompanied by a letter from my MP. This is the first real communication I have received from the TCO so have now got a standpoint to fight against.
My MP (Dave Watts, hes worth a mention as he is doing something) has stated in his letter that my concerns had not been answered by the TCO and so was writing to them once again to try to get some answers.
One little result is that they have decided that the first overpayment year was the TCOs fault and has now been written off. They are still after me for other years but its a start, my arguement being that if they got that wrong... Fill the rest in for yourself...
I now have to sit down and go through each point word by word and write a reply to MP stateing each cock up the TCO has made. Ill be the first to put my hands up and say I made a mistake here or there but not the list that they have compiled. I may owe them a few bob but not thousands.
One interesting point they raise is that I never filled in a returns form for a certain year, but they still paid me! I filled the form on line. I even rang them up when I did not receive any response and they reinstated my claim over the telephone line and after I told them I had moved they still sent documents to the wrong address!
I will be fighting even harder now as they have admitted fault even if its only one year. If they can do it once they can do it every year.
Another item: They are still quoteing higher care component (HCC) of DLA. This this the main arguement of my claim. NO where on the guideance notes does it state that you need to be in receipt of the higher allowance. All it does is ask if you receive a care component! My MP is still trying to get the TCO to admit to a fubar on this point.
I shall be keeping you informed but you know how things go... slow to stop when the TCO is concerned.
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dune
Rank; Hector Tax Inspector
15 Posts |
Posted - 21/02/2008 : 19:44:58
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| Sorry I do go on a bit ... lol |
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missfroy2
Rank; Captain Gordon
236 Posts |
Posted - 22/02/2008 : 00:47:21
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Hi Dune
After a quick read of your posts it seems that part (or all?) of your overpayment is because HMRC paid you the severe disability amount when in fact you were not entitled? To get this severe disability amount you need to be getting higher care component of DLA.
There have been quite a few of these cases go through HMRC that I have seen.
I just had a quick check of the current claim form notes and the notes from 2004 - question 1.12 is asking about receipt of Disability Living Allowance (Highest Care Component). If your argument is centering around the fact that you say the notes didn't say that - that could be why the dispute is getting turned down? (Edited to say - I think you are right in relation to the disability element - but I believe HMRC are talking about an overpayment of the severe disability amount which are two separate things).
I would try and look for other things like:
the award notices - check to see if they specifically said higher care component of DLA. It should have been on there if they thought you were getting it, but if it wasn't then you can argue it wasn't easy to check.
did you every ask anyone at HMRC for help on this or did you ever tell them what level of DLA you were getting. If so then use that as an argument.
This is a confusing element. The two out of three statements you refer to are only relevant to the disability element. You are right there is no mention of highest rate of care DLA for this. But the severe disability element does link to only the highest rate of DLA care. It seems from the pasted letter in one of your posts that you are talking about the disability element in your letters - but HMRC are talking about an overpayment of the severe disability element. The two things are separate, but it is completely understandable why claimants get the two confused. HMRC shoudl have picked up on this and explained it to you.
Also - have you asked for a copy of your claim form. You need to check box 1.11 (relating to the disability element) and box 1.12 (relating to the severe disability element). It sounds from your posts that you qualify for the disability element (and therefore should have a tick in box 1.11) but that you don't qualify for the severe disability element (and therefore shouldn't have a tick in box 1.12).
Hopefully this will help you in fighting this further.
MF2 |
Edited by - missfroy2 on 22/02/2008 00:48:54 |
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Disabled problems / Overpayment
