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Ali M-W
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3558 Posts

Posted - 20/05/2007 :  10:36:55  Show Profile Send Ali M-W a Private Message
The Tax Credit Casualties are meeting soon with 'senior officials' from HMRC. We've various questions we are going to ask them, but any suggestions you may have are welcome.

Whilst we will be talking in general rather than looking at specific cases, I also thought it wouldn't hurt to present them with a list of brief queries, perhaps with an identifying National Insurance number (you could email that to either Paula, Sarah or I if you wished, to preserve confidentiality). For instance, regarding my own case I'd like to ask: 'If I received a letter apologising for previous HMRC mistakes, for which I'd been made to pay without any mention of appeal, which promised that they would ensure all my future awards would be correctly calculated, is this not evidence that my subsequent belief that my award was right was entirely reasonable?'. (How was I supposed to know they lied?)

Just an idea for a little 'homework' for them, which might further some of our own cases, and get them thinking that some of their methods and decisions might be a little flawed...

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Alan the Geordie
Admin



3032 Posts

Posted - 20/05/2007 :  20:53:17  Show Profile Send Alan the Geordie a Private Message
You could ask them when their parents are getting married.
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Alan the Geordie
Admin



3032 Posts

Posted - 20/05/2007 :  22:44:03  Show Profile Send Alan the Geordie a Private Message
How about asking if the're natural-born arrogant incompetents or do the learn it on a training course?

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Alan the Geordie
Admin



3032 Posts

Posted - 20/05/2007 :  22:46:08  Show Profile Send Alan the Geordie a Private Message
Seriously though, one of the real questions is why they cannot be held to account for their mistakes and why they are above the law.
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Alan the Geordie
Admin



3032 Posts

Posted - 20/05/2007 :  22:51:40  Show Profile Send Alan the Geordie a Private Message
Another question; They have admitted that in my case they "made mistakes repeatedly" - and I have a letter from Primarolo that says exactly that.

So,the question is; Why, then, am I still seeing exactly the same mistakes being made against other victims??!!
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Robert
Admin



United Kingdom
829 Posts

Posted - 21/05/2007 :  12:36:38  Show Profile Send Robert a Private Message
Why do they seem not to be following the COP26 guidlines....because 74% of the HMRC judgements, are overturned by the adjudicator using the same guidellines??

The truth is out there.. GO get it..

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Ali M-W
Mod



3558 Posts

Posted - 21/05/2007 :  14:24:41  Show Profile Send Ali M-W a Private Message
Some great suggestions here - keep 'em flowing!
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n/a
deleted



39 Posts

Posted - 22/05/2007 :  15:01:32  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message
Questions for HMRC:

1. Do you agree that "Money with your name on it" failed to describe the reality of the tax credits system, since all payments are only provisional?

2. What is preventing an amnesty for all overpayments, not due to fraud, arising from the first two years of tax credits?

3. Why can't the new 25,000 income disregard be retrospectively applied to previous overpayment cases when it's obvious that the old income disregard of 2,500 was unrealistic and unworkable?

4. Why, on new applications for tax credits, does HMRC instruct applicants to make inappropriate deductions from their previous income (e.g. 100 for every week of statutory maternity pay)? Do you not agree that this artificially and incorrectly skews the income figure since those deductions should only be considered in reference to the tax year ahead, on which the final tax credit payments will be calculated? (This is quite complex but surely it's wrong that when you originally apply they're asking you to deduct income if you were on maternity last year, it's more appropriate to ask either if you plan to be on statutory maternity pay for the year ahead or, at the end of the year when payments are finalised if you were on SMP for that year?).

5. With regards to COP26, what efforts do you make to find a missing partner in a joint overpayment claim?

6. How much does it cost taxpayers to deal with one overpayment dispute i.e. HMRC issue court summons, prepare for court, then send out a TC846, respond to a TC846, then process a SARN data protection request, respond to a second tier complaint, respond to an Adjudicators Office case, and an MP, and a Financial Ombudsman investigation, including all of the staff time of all involved, telephone and mail and paper costs, any other resources costs etc?

7. Finally, HMRC rep, you personally owe me 4786.32. I don't have any paperwork or evidence of this but I've made up a nice certificate saying you owe me this money and I've signed it myself. How are you going to pay? (This reflects our experience of a meeting, pre-court, with Inland Revenue reps).

I recommend that you record your meeting with them so that they can't deny all knowledge and responsibility at a later date :-)



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Ali M-W
Mod



3558 Posts

Posted - 22/05/2007 :  17:08:40  Show Profile Send Ali M-W a Private Message
Lisa, thank you for that. I am going to compile a list of questions for HMRC. Anything we don't get to raise face-to-face I will hand to them on behalf of everyone who has gone to the trouble of making a suggestion, and ask that all serious issues such as these are properly considered and responded to.

Like you, I am heartily sick of their 'pay up because we tell you to' attitude, whilst our genuine complaints, grievances and legitimate requests for information are ignored and blanked.

It is quite simply not good enough.


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Robert
Admin



United Kingdom
829 Posts

Posted - 22/05/2007 :  21:35:12  Show Profile Send Robert a Private Message
Why are there HMRC targets to hit. in the appeals process.and anyone not hitting these targets. seem to be named and shamed, on a board for all to see..so is it easier to deny negligence or error,in the HMRC,and simply send out it's you fault letter...than probably fill out lots of forms.so missing their targets...

The truth is out there.. GO get it..

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Alan the Geordie
Admin



3032 Posts

Posted - 22/05/2007 :  23:01:18  Show Profile Send Alan the Geordie a Private Message
7 excellent questions from our new member Lisa.

Many thanks for your contribution Lisa.
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sammy
Rank; Really should become a politician



690 Posts

Posted - 22/05/2007 :  23:10:54  Show Profile Send sammy a Private Message
1) Why do ministers responsible refuse to accept that the revenue procedure for clawing back overpayments controvines the human rights act. When all bar none in the established legal profession say the government do have a case to answer.

2) Why can the revenue disregard the data protection act for none criminal cases?

3) Do revenue officials routinely give false information to MP's and judges

4) Why can revenue officials turn up uninvited (for none criminal cases, even before court) at the claiments house demanding payment.

5) Why don't the government resign en-masse

You can have my NI number no problems, let me know if you need it, which reminds me, the revenue even had my NI number wrong, even on the final bloody demand. So if you quote mine they may say, 'no such person' (I put their wrong NI number down to a minor mistake, of course I would have mentioned in court as exibit 36ish...(there were in fact much more serious mistakes) but the bloody legal system don't want to hear.

To avoid confusion, I must ad, the NI number mistake was their's, not mine

Edited by - sammy on 22/05/2007 23:27:54
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sammy
Rank; Really should become a politician



690 Posts

Posted - 22/05/2007 :  23:35:55  Show Profile Send sammy a Private Message
Ali, put a shell suit on, sun glasses, a crazy hat and ask..
Is cos am poor? -;
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Alan the Geordie
Admin



3032 Posts

Posted - 23/05/2007 :  00:25:52  Show Profile Send Alan the Geordie a Private Message
I thought she wore that rig every day!
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sammy
Rank; Really should become a politician



690 Posts

Posted - 23/05/2007 :  01:02:43  Show Profile Send sammy a Private Message
Al thats Ali M not Ali G -;
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Ali M-W
Mod



3558 Posts

Posted - 23/05/2007 :  08:31:15  Show Profile Send Ali M-W a Private Message
Shall I wear that get-up when I go to visit HMRC next month?

There was a time when our revered leader joked about pulling a Lady Godiva stunt in court on a horse! Perhaps I shouldn't have told you that - though, 'cause there'll be one or two people around these parts squabbling over who gets to be the horse!
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sammy
Rank; Really should become a politician



690 Posts

Posted - 23/05/2007 :  08:37:38  Show Profile Send sammy a Private Message
Warning! don't turn up in court naked, the judge may have a stroke.

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Alan the Geordie
Admin



3032 Posts

Posted - 23/05/2007 :  10:14:24  Show Profile Send Alan the Geordie a Private Message
Mmmmm ... Kinky!!
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n/a
deleted



39 Posts

Posted - 23/05/2007 :  14:39:06  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message
Hello again,

Ali - well done and thanks for getting a meeting. You don't say when it is, but is there any chance you could post some feedback and general answers afterwards either on this forum or the taxcreditoverpayment website? That would be so cool.

Cheers, Lisa
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Alan the Geordie
Admin



3032 Posts

Posted - 23/05/2007 :  16:48:03  Show Profile Send Alan the Geordie a Private Message
<<Warning! don't turn up in court naked, the judge may have a stroke.>>

Pardon??
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Ali M-W
Mod



3558 Posts

Posted - 23/05/2007 :  17:50:29  Show Profile Send Ali M-W a Private Message
Alan, you don't miss a trick, do you (that's why he won his case, for anyone who doesn't know).

Lisa, what are you doing on June 12th? Fancy a daytrip to London?
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