| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| sallyw67 |
Posted - 02/09/2008 : 14:47:44
I have a tax credit overpayment of £4028.69 which they are now taking me to court to recover.
They are recovering this amount because they did not receive my annual declaration which i did send. When i phoned the helpline i was told that because i moved in with my partner during this year i should of filled one single claim and one joint claim. (i informed them straight away that my circumstances had changed). This dispute has been going on since september 2005 with a judge due to hear the case in october. Am i doomed to end up with a county court against me |
| 8 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| jess |
Posted - 10/09/2008 : 22:54:45
Hi Sallyw67, I hope you have found the information on the website useful and that your MP is being supportive and helpful. If not, don't be afraid to keep coming back to the forum for advice, some forum members are good at advising how to give your MP a kick up the back side when necessary.
Part of my role with tax credit casualties is to help raise awareness of the website and our campaign for an amnesty by liaising with other organisations. It would be really helpful to know how you found out about this forum and tax credit casualties as it could help know how successful I am being!
If you don't wish to post here about how you knew about the forum, you can email me: jess@taxcc.org.uk Any information you give me may be shared amongst the the co-ordinators and webmaster, but will not be released outside of ourselves in any identifiable form that could be attributed to you.
good luck
All Human Beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, not to attacks upon his honor and reputation. Everyone has the right to protection of the law against such interference or attacks
Articles 1 and 12 Universal Declaration of Human Rights 1948.
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| Ali M-W |
Posted - 10/09/2008 : 07:26:28
This is taken directly from the website at www.taxCC.org, so the links embedded in the text won't work, but I thought some may need to see his:
If you haven't started the dispute process yet, but have received a summons, please read Dispute Not Started ?
If you have already started your dispute, the priority at the moment is to get the Court case stopped. You have good grounds to do this if you feel you have received no final response to your last RRR / Dispute / letter / data request / report of faulty data / complaint. Because, if they have not done an RRR response, or they didn't send you the result, or if you have submitted an RRR etc. to either the Adjudicator or the Ombudsman, the process has not yet been exhausted. This basically means they can’t take you to court yet.
Don't think that if you get to court you will "have your say"! HMRC issue a "Certificate of Debt", and the court HAS to find in their favour. Nothing you say will make ANY difference. Read A Cautionary Tale, if you haven't already!
The first thing to do is contact your MP as soon as possible. If they need persuading that they need to act immediately, (i.e. now), insist that they are your only representation in this matter, it is their duty to uphold your rights and that your MP is the only person who can contact the following offices on your behalf. MPs contact details can be found here, MP’s Contact Details, or there's an easier search for your MP here. Local directories should also list an evening contact number for them.
Get your MP to ring the MP Tax Credit Hotline. Your MP will probably need your National Insurance number. Get them to lodge a complaint that the Appeals / RRR / Dispute process has not been exhausted and order that the court case is withdrawn. If they need some guidance on what to say, tell your MP to use the arguments in my second paragraph, above.
Get your MP to instruct the Directors' Customer Service Team to CONFIRM the case has been halted. If the Director’s Customer Service Team refuses, point out that they are breaking their own legislation on recovery practice.
If they will not confirm it, your MP needs to ring :
The Court (although this will probably be for guidance on exactly who to contact to get it stopped).
The Director’s Customer Service Team on 01772 887761. * It seems that this 'phone line is now closed - 29 Nov 2007 *
The Adjudicator’s Office on 020 7930 2292.
The Parliamentary Ombudsman on 0845 015 4033.
The MP Tax Credit Helpline …… your MP should have the telephone number for this.
….. until they confirm the case has been halted due to the fact the dispute process has not been exhausted and recovery cannot take place.
That should get it halted, and give you some breathing space to complete the TCO Dispute process, then the extended appeals process.
Now go to How to Dispute. You may have already started some of the steps, i.e. the data request (Dispute - Step 2) and/or contacting your MP (Dispute - Step 4). That's not a problem. Just make sure to do the in-between bits. Hope this helps. Sorry it's so convoluted, but unfortunately that's the TCO’s fault.
Please contact me if you have any questions.
http://www.taxcc.org/Dispute_Stopping_Court_Cases.html
If you want any ideas regarding going to the Press, you can always contact me via the website.
I won't publish my email address here, because contrary to what seems to be a popular belief, I don't have erection problems, don't need any hairloss ointment, don't want to receive emails about an HSBC account I don't even have, don't have any unknown uncles in Nigeria who have left me a fortune so long as I part with huge cheques to get it, don't want to receive any more emails with innuendoes in the subject line, and don't like Spam in my inbox any more than I like it out of a tin!
Good luck! Ali.
Trinity: The answer is out there… and it's looking for you, and it will find you if you want it to.
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| Ali M-W |
Posted - 10/09/2008 : 07:18:48
THIS GOVERNMENT LIES!!!!
"20 Feb 2007 : Column 598W—continued
Welfare Tax Credits: Overpayments
Mr. Betts: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer how many people have received correspondence from HM Revenue and Customs threatening court action over the repayment of tax credit overpayments; and how many have (a) subsequently become the subject of a court case and (b) been convicted. [118635]
Dawn Primarolo [holding answer 6 February 2007]: HM Revenue and Customs issue at least two written applications for repayment of tax credit overpayments and where possible attempt to make personal contact with the customer, including by telephone, before taking court action.
A court summons is always the last resort. It is estimated that less than 2.5 per cent. of direct recovery of tax credit overpayment cases will proceed to court action. In the financial year to end of January 2007 some 37,000 court actions were initiated by the issue of a summons and these are at various stages of the court process.
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200607/cmhansrd/cm070220/text/70220w0010.htm
Please arm yourself with this ridiculous and clearly false piece of Primarolo Bull**** and INSIST your MP stops this Kangaroo Court Action NOW - as your case is still in dispute and you have way to go before the process is ended! You have the right to have HMRC's own ruling, then the Adjudicator, then the Parliamentary Ombudsman.
If your MP is Nu Labour, you will probably need to remind them that the integrity of their government is falling into disrepute due to HMRC's determination to pursue court cases whilst disputes are still under way (or in many cases before people even know of their right to dispute and also COMPLAIN - the latter being a separate task as HMRC are incapable of spotting when disputes are actually also complaints of maltreatment). Opposition MPs will probably need far less persuasion. If HMRC actually kept and released statistics of overpayments they have pursued to full recovery, I would love to see these, as I have a hunch that recovery rates from Nu Labour constituents would greatly exceed recovery rates from areas where there are non-Brown-loving MPs. We will unfortunately never, ever know the truth of this beause HMRC either don't record or won't disclose. The court case absolutely CAN be stopped - it's just more hard work than your MP wants to undertake, and is in itself an admission of system failure, which your Nu Labour MP would never want to make. If your MP won't stop the case, PLEASE get in touch urgently with Paula Dean (PJ, or PJD on this Forum), who has had masny a court case stopped on behalf of the innocent.
Depending on how passionately you feel about being a victim of gross injustice and a sacrificial lamb for Brown's reputation, you might consider TELLING your MP you are going to go to the Press if (s)he doesn't stop this injustice.
Are you Legal Aid elligible? If so, counter-action can be launched. But for the bulk of us, the best option is getting your MP on board.
Any injustices you suffer should all be avoidable with your MP actually pulling their finger out and justifying their salary/expenses in their service to YOU the constituent, and/or from a little pressure from your local - or if really brave, National - newspaper. However, if you really do end up trapped, let us know, because you could be part of the Judicial Review planning (funds permitting) against HMRC for its Human Rights abuses and all the rest.
And anyone who knows any bountiful philanthropists or millionnaires willing to make - for them - a small donation, we will ALL have justice before we know it, through legal action. Remember us in your Lottery wins! 
Trinity: The answer is out there… and it's looking for you, and it will find you if you want it to.
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| auntieh |
Posted - 09/09/2008 : 22:05:44
It's my understanding that if you have lodged a dispute any court proceedings in the pipeline MUST be halted. Mine was stopped at very short notice (about two to three weeks if I recall) once I realised I could dispute and notified HMRC of my intention to do so.
All sorts of court cases, criminal and civil, are called off at short notice all the time. I can't see any reason why matters pertaining to the HMRC circus should be any different.
I agree with Ali, your MP can stop this and you need to insist that he/does so. If you go to court, you will have no opportunity to present your side of the story and the judge must find in favour of HMRC because they will produce a 'certificate of debt', which the judge has no power to overturn.
Auntie
"You can dress a pig in a suit but you can't stop it grunting" |
| Ali M-W |
Posted - 09/09/2008 : 17:04:48
You are being denied a fair trial! I do think your MP needs to know this. We are talking about a Human Rights Act breach here. You cannot and will not win! Your MP should be able to stop this - please insist that (s)he does. Otherwise, do get in touch with Paula URGENTLY.
Trinity: The answer is out there… and it's looking for you, and it will find you if you want it to.
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| sallyw67 |
Posted - 09/09/2008 : 15:49:38
Right thanks. I left a message for my MP and they phoned today and asked if i could bring all the information and attend a meeting. The case worker for my MP went through all the paperwork and explained everything so i could understand! She phoned the MP hotline but they said they could not halt the court case as it was too late. The original court case was for July but hrmc asked if i would not attend as they needed time to receive all the information. The court then sent a Standard order for stay for settlement with consent of all parties. The hotline said they now couldnt stop the court case as it had gone to debt recovery and they couldnt speak to my MP or the hotline, debt recovery could only speak with me. The case worker for my MP said she would write to HMRC MP complaints manager about my case but thought the court case had gone to far to stop. The stay is till 31st oct and i can ask for an extension if debt recovery confirm agreement. |
| Robert |
Posted - 07/09/2008 : 13:25:56
Hi sally
As aunty says, get your MP to stop the courtcase, as all the HMRC will do, is produce a piece of paper..Certificate of debt,self signed by themselves ..judge will say case proved, and you will have no say whatsoever..
The truth is out there.. GO get it......Non Illigitamus Carborundum
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| auntieh |
Posted - 02/09/2008 : 21:24:22
Hi Sally
In view of what you say your first priority should be to get the court proceedings halted by putting in a dispute form. Go to the main website www.taxcc.org and follow the links for disputing and stopping court proceedings. HMRC must halt the proceedings whilst you are disputing. You should also get your MP involved and he or she can also get the hearing stopped. Avoid going to court at all costs as once you are there, the judge is bound to find in favour of HMRC and cannot hear any evidence you might want to present.
You will need to request all the information about your claim in HMRC's records by submitting a SARN request. Sorry this all sounds like double dutch but all is explained on the main website.
Others will be along soon to advise you in more detail about what happens in cases where HMRC is claiming not to have received annual declarations. You might want to look at this thread as some of the points about stopping court cases and missing declarations are mentioned there.
http://familytaxcredit.forumco.com/topic~TOPIC_ID~1143.asp
Good luck!
Auntie
"You can dress a pig in a suit but you can't stop it grunting" |
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